Showing messages 1 through 3 of 3.

• I agree with the Devleoper
  2003-06-30 08:49:30  Tim O'Reilly | [Reply | View]
  
  
  I have to disagree here. Apple or Microsoft copying contextual menus from some other developer seems entirely fair to me, and not a rip off. This industry progresses by imitation. If companies couldn't copy each others improvements, progress would come to a standstill. And of course, that's just what's going to happen as more and more software ideas get patented.
  

  
  There's a big difference between imitating incremental improvements, though, and going after a complete standalone market that a new company has created. Of course, even that sometimes is necessary for the good of the platform, but in a case like that, I'd say the right approach is for the platform player to try at least to buy the independent developer's idea.
  

  
  Some technologies really belong as part of a platform, so that they can be leveraged by more than one application. Especially in the early stages of a market, some companies introduce software that is really only enough to be "a feature", while others introduce software that can succeed as a standalone application or application family, while others introduce offerings that are broad enough to morph into platforms in their own right, with a secondary developer market.
  

  
  In addition to the scale of what's being copied, you have to look at the competitive situation. For example, it seems to me that Microsoft has often gone after application vendors whose products threaten them in some way. Apple, on the other hand, has tended to add applications into their platform that open up new markets, and actually lead the way for more powerful equivalents to arise in the third party market.
  

  
  There are no hard and fast answers, but there is a desirable attitude. That is, recognize that for a platform to be a success, there have to be opportunities for more than the platform vendor. Work to create those opportunities, knowing that by so doing, you are extending your own work many fold, by encouraging others to invest time, money and creativity building out what you started.

• I don't agree
  2003-06-30 02:35:31  anonymous2 [Reply | View]
  
  
  Well if the best example you can come up with is contextural menus....
  First of all lets look at a couple of facts: iTunes was Apples rebranding of another product/small developer THEY BOUGHT.
  Secondly Watson is still going strong....I mean so what if Apple came out with Sherlock....do you hear Jobs crowing about Sherlock recently? I've used both and still prefer Watson....with any luck Apple will simply buy Watson and maybe market it as "son of Sherlock"

• All or Nothing?
  2003-06-30 01:15:06  jmincey [Reply | View]
  
  
  The implication of your post (if I understand you) is disturbing. You seem to be saying that Apple's failure to innovate ALL the technology it uses is proof that it innovates nothing. I don't know anyone -- not even the greatest champion of Apple -- who suggests that Apple has innovated every technology it uses. Indeed, NO company can make that claim; and it's a preposterous standard to hold a company to. So, yes, you rightly point out some examples where Apple took the ideas of others and implemented them on the Mac platform. But what would you have Apple do? Would you have it use ONLY those technologies it creates in house? If it did that, then Apple would again be criticized for the "Not invented here" mentality.
  
  Can you spell "No win"?
  
  From my point of view, Apple strikes the right balance between innovation and making the most of existing technology. Apple's innovations include Open Doc, Rendezvous, Firewire (in conjunction with other parties), Truetype font architecture, ColorSync, and many other things. Apple was also a first adopter or one of the first on many other technologies. After all, there is value not only in innovation but also in implementation.
  
  Does Apple borrow some good ideas from other sources? Yes. Does this preclude any innovation of its own? Does it snuff out third-party development? No -- on both counts. These things are not mutually exclusive. So I'm sorry, but I really don't know what point you are trying to make. If it's that Apple is not innovative -- and if your "proof" consists in such things as contextual menus and Sherlock, I'm afraid your logic escapes me.
  
  As for encouraging development, I think we need to recalibrate our expectations of what is fundamental to computer operation (and thus rightly within the domain of a computer company) and what in contrast falls outside that domain. Font management is not a luxury to an OS -- especially not to a platform which serves the graphics niche market. The only reason that third parties developed font management utilities is that in the early years of desktop personal computing, such things were slow in coming from the OS developers themselves. (They had their hands full with other things.) But as the technology matures, these things are becoming more integrated, as they should.
  
  Do you remember the days when third party developers offered file search utilities? Do you think it's realistic that a computer company like Apple should leave this "market" wide open in the name of "encouraging developers"? Do you not think that to search for a file is fundamental to the OS? Well, the same goes for other software that once was a rich source for independent developers -- including disk diag/repair tools, file managers, browsers, batch renamers, archivers and compression tools, and many other things. People have higher expectations today of an OS. I, for one, do not wish to be at the mercy of independent developers for functions as basic as contextual menus or managing my fonts. If developers wish to do Apple one better in these areas -- more power to them. But I don't begrudge Apple one instant for its choice to integrate these things into the OSX package.
  
  Jeff Mincey